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Post by Paul on May 13, 2011 11:57:50 GMT -5
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Post by Maarten on May 13, 2011 12:49:28 GMT -5
Perhaps being homosexual itself isn't the sin (like "being tempted by porn" isn't a sin in it of itself), but rather, committing homosexual lust and/or acts is the sin. "but each person is tempted when they are dragged away by their own evil desire and enticed. Then, after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death." (James 1:14-15) So being tempted is in fact the fault of the one being tempted.
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Post by Paul on May 13, 2011 15:38:12 GMT -5
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Post by Maarten on May 14, 2011 7:12:51 GMT -5
But how is something a temptation if you don't actually desire it though? If I come across porn and my only reaction is to be disgusted by the sin, how is that a temptation?
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Post by Radiant Magnificence Alastair on May 15, 2011 7:21:15 GMT -5
It's not.
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Post by Maarten on May 15, 2011 7:26:52 GMT -5
So then, if you can only be tempted if you actually desire the thing you are tempted to do, as James shows us, how could Jesus have been tempted in all ways as we are?
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Post by Radiant Magnificence Alastair on May 15, 2011 9:05:19 GMT -5
Does it say that in the bible?
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Post by Maarten on May 15, 2011 12:07:33 GMT -5
Yep, Hebrews 4:15
"For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin."
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Post by Azrael on May 17, 2011 20:15:58 GMT -5
This I disagree with. I remember the parable where the father invites people to his son's wedding. One of the men comes and refuses to change out of his clothes. He is tossed out. That's talking about refusing to change our lives. We know what God wants from us. We need to become what he has set out for us and we can't cling to the things that we want or believe are right for ourselves. This is sounding very sketchy, Azrael. I typically agree with a lot that you say, but this sound very works-based and legalistic. Consider: If I still struggle with a particular sin 10 years from now, will I be "tossed out" of the Kingdom? A person who is a homosexual Christian now might still be tempted by homosexual thoughts down the road, but I will still struggle with lust and pride ten years down the road too. Perhaps being homosexual itself isn't the sin (like "being tempted by porn" isn't a sin in it of itself), but rather, committing homosexual lust and/or acts is the sin. Or am I misunderstanding you? I think this issue causes a lot of issues because people misuse the term they should use WITH LESS RHYME: people identify themselves by their sexuality, people don't identify themselves with other sins. People don't say "I'm a liar," or "I've got so much pride it's ridiculous," or "I'm SUCH a blasphemer of the Holy Spirit" people say " I'm gay," or " No I'm not!" And this causes problems because people say things like "you can be a homosexual and a Christian," and it can be taken two ways. Either they're saying you can be actively living a homosexual lifestyle (which is rightly condemned) or they're saying you can be a Christian though you may be tempted by homosexuality. Which implies the same struggles as with every other temptation/sin, and should not be condemned. They are called to not sin in this area, but some may still label them as 'homosexual' when making statements like the aforementioned. I think this sums itself up pretty well. The idea is that we recognize and walk away from our identities in order to become better believers. If you consciously choose to reject certain tenets of the faith because they clash with your personal identity, you won't make it. You're still wearing your clothes. This deals more with people who choose to redefine and reinterpret doctrine to suit their own personal ideas.
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